Wealth

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Since the Chronicle is running a series of articles on all the new money that has flooded the area over the past decade or so, I thought it would be fair to open up a discussion topic on the impact of wealth in general.

How has the influx of money affected you, good or ill? How has it affected your neighborhood, your town, your wallet? Is this ultimately a good thing for the area, or has it somehow altered this part of Montana at a fundamental level?

Talk amongst yourselves...
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posted on Tue, Apr 15, 2008 10:06 PM
last updated on Wed, Apr 16, 2008 11:31 AM
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Nouveau Riche byArt3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
The impression I have and that I think a lot of others have is that the wealthy who have joined us are the nouveau riche or newly rich. Those are the ones with the attitude and who may not graciously know how to handle their wealth. But that may be illusionary as there are those who are the old rich, and though their pockets may be stuffed with cash, you wouldn't know it.
Loaded Question bydanie0063 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
Cripes - where do I start?

The Chronicle articles were interesting. I think Art's obvservation is accurate.

I keep thinking that if the newly wealthy were ever in a tight spot and they couldn't fix the problem with cash, they'd perish.

I think money ultimately wrecks people - it seems to turn them into something that society shouldn't have to put up with. I love standing in line at the grocery store behind the person in the fancy jacket and expensive jewelery whining about some superficial issue, or yelling at the clerk over something out of their control. I can recall two instances in the last 4 months where I've witnessed such behavior. Real classy.

Is this influence of money and wealthy folks good for Bozeman? Hardly. It is unfortunate that the natives have to put up with the influx of wealthy. Poor manners, inflated real estate values, and big city expectations are tiring and didn't exist in Bozeman 10 years ago to the extent we see today.

I completely believe in capitalism, but I don't really care for what it seems to do to people who vastly succeed.
Is it envy? bygixa3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
I was sorry that the Chronicle chose to run this series — on the front page no less! — at a time when so many people are struggling to make ends meet. It seems disrespectful to those in serious need. IMHO the paper was being intentionally devisive and adding fuel to the fire for those who need to blame the "evil rich" for their troubles. For that reason, I read very few of the articles.

Granted, some wealthy people behave very badly and seem to be in their own little world. (So do a lot of folks who are not wealthy. Boorishness is an equal opportunity employer.) A great many wealthy folks in the Gallatin Valley are humble, unpretentious, and generous. They donate to many charities and foundations and help our community far more abundantly than I will ever be able to afford. Some, not all, have brought badly needed jobs to our valley and are employing local workers. They are also partaking of local goods and services while they are here, contributing even more money to our town. Contrary to what many people think, the wealthy are also paying huge taxes that go into the state's coffers.

It makes me ashamed to hear folks complain about the lack of jobs and opportunity here yet characterize some of the people who contribute the most to our community as evil.
RE: Is it envy? byjeh3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
O.k. so it sounds like you have read most of them actually and apologize if I came on strong.

But I guess I don't understand your comments then about the series being disrespectful. I've found them to be very informative, albeit a bit infuriating (especially the part on the second day when the rug/French armoire seller said he doesn't deal with "the public" anymore). I had to put the paper down for awhile after I read that. It's that sort of attitude and that of conspicuous consumption when there ARE so many people struggling (myself included in that, by the way) to just pay the bills and eat reasonably well.
RE: Is it envy? bygixa3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
Please refer to the sentence, "I read very few of the articles." Perhaps you missed my first two sentences about people struggling to make ends meet in the rush to accuse me of being divisive and uneducated.

To clarify, I read the 'Wealth's Great Divide' on Tuesday, the one on Ted Turner (enjoyed that one) on Wednesday, and 'Agriculture at the Crossroads' today. I think that qualifies as "being educated about that which [I] write".
RE: Is it envy? byjeh3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
gixa --

Weird, that last reply deleted my first one so please look back at where the first was if you are interested in my response. I hope you will.
RE: Is it envy? bygixa3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
Guess I will tone it down and apologize, too. I also read part of the one about the rug/armoire seller. It was pretty hard to take. That's part of what I meant by disrespectful. I could just imagine the pain it caused some people to read that when they have to choose between gassing the car or buying groceries.

Can't remember if it was part of the series or not, but did you read about the women who have made a successful business catering to the private jet service? It made me sad because the article was slanted in a way that (to me) trivialized the fact that these women were very dedicated and came up with a unique business that fills a niche. It made it sound as though they were only successful because the 'evil rich' jet setters are so finicky. There is probably some truth in that but I would have rather seen acknowledgment of the women's savvy accomplishment.
What happened to the comment sequence? bygixa3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
Looks like the comments got turned around somehow.
Haves and the have nots....... bydwainegf3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
We will always have the haves and the have nots. That has been the case throughout history and will continue to be so. The "rich" in today's media are portayed as "evil". We hear the politicians saying "We need to tax the rich." Most people shout "Amen" when they hear this. Let's be realistic about this. The rich are already the ones paying the most taxes. The question is IMHO "Is this fair?" I say it is not. I feel that everyone should be taxed at exactly the same rate. No loopholes, no deductions, a flat rate. Having said this I will clarify my standing in society. I am middle class all the way. Through my upbringing to today, I have been a member of the middle class. The exception to this could be the 6 years I served in the military. My income may not have qualified as middle class.
Why is it that as a society we feel entitled to anything more than what we earn?
Why shouldn't we feel compelled to be self sufficient?
As for rude behavior, I've seen snobishness from the wealthy and I've seen rudeness from the middle class and I've seen poor behavior from the poor. My point is, there are bad apples everywhere. We just tend to focus on those more fortunate and put them under the microscope when it comes to their attitudes or behavior.
So -- where do you find the wealthy residents who help others? bymotivatekc3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
I think this is an interesting discussion. I understand dwainegf's comment about "why shouldn't we feel compelled to be self sufficient?", and gixa's comment that "They donate to many charities and foundations and help our community far more abundantly than I will ever be able to afford."

I know a special lady who has lived in Bozeman for more than 16 years. She and her husband have worked hard and have made a difference. But, she is in desperate need of a bone biopsy that has to be done at Mayo, and then a back surgery for Tarlov Cysts (extremely rare disease that has physically limited her activities to virtually nothing). The cost for these two procedures will be in the neighborhood of $50,000. I know she wishes she could be self sufficient, and not ask for help, but today she needs the help.

So, my question for each of you, where does she go to find these individuals who donate to charities and want to help their local residents? She has a medical charity account set up at a local bank in Bozeman.

Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Tina :)
RE: So -- where do you find the wealthy residents who help others? bygixa3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
I have no experience with medical charities but I'd be willing to guess that Bozeman Deaconess has someone who does. Is it possible that the Mayo Clinic has some program that will help her? (They receive substantial grants from private individuals and corporations.) Also, you're helping by mentioning it here. If you're so inclined, it would make a wonderful post, especially if it includes the name of the bank with the charity account and information about how to donate. The Chronicle and some of the local radio stations might also be willing to publicize it.

It's wonderful that you're trying to help, and I hope my suggestions aren't redundant in light of anything you have already done.
RE: So -- where do you find the wealthy residents who help others? bymotivatekc3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
Gixa --

Thank you for your feedback. I'll start a new discussion topic called, Bozeman helping their own, and I'll include all the details, including her name, the bank medical account info, etc. Once again, if you know of anyone that can help, it will be so appreciated.

I'm encouraged by the story of the small community who stepped up to help one of their own with breast cancer. I really believe we are better when we help those in need around us.

Thanks again!

Tina :)
Altering Montana at a Fundamental Level byCHAD3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
For much of Montana's history, agriculture has been the way of life for most residents. Agriculture has never been a wealthy industry and this helps to spawn a community of neighbors helping neighbors. This community atmosphere is what draws many people to Montana. But as farmers and ranchers struggle and find better ways to make money (subdivide, sell to the wealthy) this sense of community is diminished.

I have a perfect example for motivatekc: I grew up in a community of 350 in Montana and one of the school's teachers was diagnosed with breast cancer a few years ago. Her family operates a ranch, is far from wealthy, and the insurance money for treatment ran out fast. The community immediately responded by setting up a fund, which grew so fast that the family closed the account because it had exceeded their needs. The town of 350 raised more money than one "wealthy" person would ever dream of donating.

Having more millionaires in Bozeman will never benefit the area unless they start acting as part of the Montana community.
observation on local culture bycwrite3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
Did anyone else notice that the Chronicle changed it's masthead to resemble the Wall Street Journal just before they began this front page series? I think the whole series is designed to appeal to the returning population that only lives here during the snowless months. They like to read about themselves. They are annoying because the rest of us keep the economy & everything else going while they are away so they can return to recreate & party. While they are here they point out how backward or uninformed we are, demanding services that cost big bucks in taxes, altering the culture of the community as they go. They don't really care what happens while they are away, just that their needs are met while they are here.
RE: observation on local culture bytiredofbeingjudged3 months ago (0 votes) (report abuse)
excellent observation, hadn't thought of it before now. good timing, indeed.
Bozeman "Culture" byberrymountain2 months ago (1 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
The people who cater to the rich and wealthy, are not living so well for the most part. Come on folks, this is no longer a "conservative" agricultural community.

One thing we've noticed, is the number of "charity/non-profits" who are making a fortune from the locals with "mental illness." This all on the "taxpayer" back.

Big Sky is the "Kingdom," and let's face it folks, most living in Bozeman are the "Serf's."

It's amazing to listen to folks brag about how they "Work in Big Sky." What a mentality...
Headed for another Aspen byAlphaBeagle2 weeks ago (0 votes) (report abuse) (reply)
We thought it couldn't happen here - but it is. Bozeman is becoming another Aspen. When the wealthy moved into Aspen, they drove the locals out. The wealthy use their money to drive the rest of us, the "riff-raff" out - but out just far enough that we can still come into town to work for them. They just don't want us living in trailer courts near them - heaven forbid! But we do such a good job cleaning their toilets, landscaping their lawns and so forth - they can't drive us too far away! The wealthy must maintain their "Shangra La" at the expense of the rest of us, who they think about as much of as I do the magpies that light in my yard once in a while.